Who’s the one to blame? (Society?)

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  • Anonymous
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    #102493

         People call me everywhere racist for telling an honest opinion. They not even try to understand it. I decided to make a topic about this issue. I admit it, this “black actors” hysteria and overhype makes me mad. People trying to put labels on actors calling them black or white. Yes. It’s hard to get a job if you’re black. Or find a job at all if you are a woman, either black or white. We get it! But who is the one to blame? The Academy? Which actually trying to recognize them with Oscars? No. The whole society is the one to blame. 

       So why are we trying to make this whole Oscar game political? The first black actor who won an Oscar. The first black woman who won an Oscar. The only black actress who has more than one nomination. The youngest black actress nominee. Why are these records? Who cares? Why we “rooting them” when it’s about a chance to see another winner from the black community? Aren’t these records makes black people different than the white actors? Why can’t you just say that “Halle Berry won an Oscar, I’m so happy for it” – why you have to put a label on her that “I didn’t enjoy her performance, but at least she’s black and won as the first black actress”? No. She won for a performance. I don’t care that she’s black or white, she’s amazing and won her Oscar deservedly. 

    Also, why everybody gets so emotional when someone say a bad thing  about like a black actress? Call him racist of faggot, when he’s maybe just didn’t like her performance or her as an actress seems stupid to me. 

    “Mostly white men in the Academy, who are voting for why people.” – 

    These kind of statements coused such a thing that today a black performer can be winning or being nominated for an Academy Award for being black instead of the performance. You guys trying to critize the Academy about the black actors so much, so they prove it that they are not racist and giving an award for an underserved performance. That’s a shame. The best performance should win and not the color.

    The society should finally grab some balls, write official letters to studios, make publick speeches or petitions and say that “we want more black performers in movies and TV”. Until the society is fine with mostly white performers in movies and TV Programms, nothing’s gonna happen. We can bitching about the Academy but the only way that this political shit around black people will stop if people will start to beleive that it’s all about us and our needs. If people will finally goes for a movie which casted lead black actors and not for some Angelina Jolie (I love her) shit all the time then big big big people will start to realize that this situation needs to be fixed as soon as it possible and then all of this stupid talk and records will remain trash and we can concentrate the performances instead of the color. 

    I’m not from the USA, sorry for the grammar mistakes. 

    Reply
    Beau S.
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    #102495

    The Oscars are political because of the people who vote for them. It’s not your fault, not my fault, not the actors’ fault, not the directors’ fault.

    You already stated this, but it is a major reason. The Oscars are voted for by (correct me if I’m wrong) a voting body that is 93% white men who grew up in 1950’s-1960’s America. It’s extremely likely, depending where they grew up, that they were raised with racial prejudices. Psychologically it is very difficult to move past or “un-learn” something that was taught to you at a very young age, so this prejudice has stayed with them their whole lives. Because these white men usually only recognize white nominees, it makes it a major moment when Halle Berry becomes the first black actress to win Best Actress, or when Whoopi Goldberg becomes the first black actress to receive two Oscar nominations, or when a two black actors win Best Actor and Best Actress on the same night. It’s even prominent beyond the Academy. How many directors who grew up in the days of segregation in America, such as Scorsese, Coppola, etc actually make films that feature black characters? It’s mostly the younger, up-and-coming filmmakers that make films featuring black characters in prominent roles.

    This is not going to last forever. Most of the world but especially America is becoming more progressive, and while racism still exists it is not nearly as populous and rampant as it once was. As soon as progressive-minded voters (such as the aforementioned younger, up-and-coming filmmakers) make up the majority of the Academy, the Oscars’ attitude towards blacks will become much more positive. It’s not just race too. The older, traditional voters tend to vote for traditional films (which is why Pulp Fiction lost Best Picture, and why David Lynch doesn’t have an Oscar). As soon as the riskier filmmakers make up the majority of the Academy, riskier films and riskier filmmakers will win Oscars.

    Your question makes sense. It is very difficult to understand American race relations if you were not born and educated in America. And for somebody who’s first language isn’t English, you actually do a very good job communicating in it.

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    black30
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    #102496

    You’re a foreigner who has no cultural sensitivity to a very American issue. If race isn’t a concern to you please do not interfere in the conversations about it on an American forum about an American institution like Hollywood and the Academy Awards. We know of what we speak you on the other hand are an outsider looking in and mocking what you don’t understand. Race is a deeply rooted thing and you’re indifferent which is your right. But makes it impossible for you to comment on the subject in a productive capacity.  

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    babypook
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    #102497

    @vince

      ” So why are we trying to make this whole Oscar game political?  “

    My sweet Vince; the Oscars are already political, just like everything else in life including the freaking weather (thanks, HAARP). I appreciate your concerns but pretending things are ideal when they are far from that, isnt going to further anything.
    We’ve come a long way but we have so much further to go. Who knows? Perhaps we can return to the ancient Matriarchies where there was no evidence of violence, and wars.
    Didnt you dislike Beasts of the Southern Wild? Now there’s a society I admire, with no prejudice, no racism, no societal dictates.

    Sigh. What a topic for the Oscar forums. I admire it though, since it’s so damned different from what we usually ‘discuss’ in here……
          

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    eastwest
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    #102498

    You’re a foreigner who has no cultural sensitivity to a very American issue. If race isn’t a concern to you please do not interfere in the conversations about it on an American forum about an American institution like Hollywood and the Academy Awards. We know of what we speak you on the other hand are an outsider looking in and mocking what you don’t understand. Race is a deeply rooted thing and you’re indifferent which is your right. But makes it impossible for you to comment on the subject in a productive capacity.  

    BINGO! 

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    BrokenFan
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    #102499

    You’re a foreigner who has no cultural sensitivity to a very American issue. If race isn’t a concern to you please do not interfere in the conversations about it on an American forum about an American institution like Hollywood and the Academy Awards. We know of what we speak you on the other hand are an outsider looking in and mocking what you don’t understand. Race is a deeply rooted thing and you’re indifferent which is your right. But makes it impossible for you to comment on the subject in a productive capacity.  

    Sorry, but you specifically go out of your way to attack anyone who you think made a “racist” remarks. This is kinda like reverse-racism mixed in with a bit of paranoia. According to you, anyone who doesn’t agree that, for example, Viola Davis deserved the Oscar or even be in the line-up (like me) makes them racist, which is totally untrue. Just because it’s a “deeply rooted issue”, one cannot just blame all of life’s problems on it, and in this case, unsatisfactory Oscar results, especially when it doesn’t have anything to do with race at all. I totally agree with the OP that it shouldn’t be about the color, but the quality of the work presented, and that you shouldn’t be accusing the academy of being racist, when it’s Hollywood that doesn’t produce lead roles for people of color. I say this as an Asian man. You think Black actors are underrepresented? You should look at the Asians. What about latino/a? To me at least when we’re including race as a factor just for the sake of diversity and not for the quality of performance makes things so much less interesting.

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    black30
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    #102500

    Sorry, but you specifically go out of your way to attack anyone who you think made a “racist” remarks. This is kinda like reverse-racism mixed in with a bit of paranoia. According to you, anyone who doesn’t agree that, for example, Viola Davis deserved the Oscar or even be in the line-up (like me) makes them racist, which is totally untrue. Just because it’s a “deeply rooted issue”, one cannot just blame all of life’s problems on it, and in this case, unsatisfactory Oscar results, especially when it doesn’t have anything to do with race at all. I totally agree with the OP that it shouldn’t be about the color, but the quality of the work presented, and that you shouldn’t be accusing the academy of being racist, when it’s Hollywood that doesn’t produce lead roles for people of color. I say this as an Asian man. You think Black actors are underrepresented? You should look at the Asians. What about latino/a? To me at least when we’re including race as a factor just for the sake of diversity and not for the quality of performance makes things so much less interesting.

    I’m irritable and I’m especially bitchy when it comes to the Meryl Streep is God complex. I never initially thought everyone who didn’t want Viola Davis to win or even receive the nomination was being racist more so going out of their way to prove how much better Streep actually was—that her closest competition should have never been competition at all. 

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    Tye-Grr
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    #102501

    I don’t really want to comment on the whole race issue, I can see reasoning for both sides of the argument (race shouldn’t matter, it’s about the performance vs how getting the nomination/win can possibly help move voters in the direction of looking at more than white-friendly Oscar bait films), but I just needed to comment that I am absolutely not racist in the slightest and I am in the camp that wouldn’t have nominated Davis for ‘The Help’. She was in my Top 10 though. That being said, Streep wouldn’t have been my winner either. In fact, my personal Top 3 choices weren’t even nominated. Regardless, I don’t begrudge Ms. Davis her nomination as I did enjoy her performance (she and Chastain especially were better than the film deserved), and I think she makes an impression even with limited screen time (‘Doubt’ and ‘Out of Sight’ always come to mind).

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    Anonymous
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    #102502

    Well, I do think that Viola Davis is a medicore actress. And everytime I said that on any forums people called me racist for attacking a black actress when I’m not even say a word about her color but more about her overrated work. That’s also an issue.  

    The race topic is way to sensitive in my opinion and sometimes people who are from the USA trying to attack outsiders because they have a different opinion and calling them “racist” or “f.u.c.k” for poining out that it’s isn’t so obvious to say that “Viola Davis should’ve win, she’s a great actress” and so on. Or any black actors. It’s not obvious to like them. I have several black actors I like or several Oscars which they won I like but for example I can’t stand Octavia Spencer’s Oscar win. She was the weakest supporting in The Help. Of course it would have been also “racist” for so many of the fans that the Academy would’ve choose a white actress to win for a movie which was about black maids…

    So the main thing I would like to say about this that sometimes people are not racist for telling that someone is not good. I’m judging based on the performances.  

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    BrokenFan
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    #102503

    [quote=”Boogawooga”]
    Sorry, but you specifically go out of your way to attack anyone who you think made a “racist” remarks. This is kinda like reverse-racism mixed in with a bit of paranoia. According to you, anyone who doesn’t agree that, for example, Viola Davis deserved the Oscar or even be in the line-up (like me) makes them racist, which is totally untrue. Just because it’s a “deeply rooted issue”, one cannot just blame all of life’s problems on it, and in this case, unsatisfactory Oscar results, especially when it doesn’t have anything to do with race at all. I totally agree with the OP that it shouldn’t be about the color, but the quality of the work presented, and that you shouldn’t be accusing the academy of being racist, when it’s Hollywood that doesn’t produce lead roles for people of color. I say this as an Asian man. You think Black actors are underrepresented? You should look at the Asians. What about latino/a? To me at least when we’re including race as a factor just for the sake of diversity and not for the quality of performance makes things so much less interesting.

    I’m irritable and I’m especially bitchy when it comes to the Meryl Streep is God complex. I never initially thought everyone who didn’t want Viola Davis to win or even receive the nomination was being racist more so going out of their way to prove how much better Streep actually was—that her closest competition should have never been competition at all. [/quote]

    You really need to take the things said on this forum with a grain of salt and also remember that most of the responses are opinion-based. People have preferences and biases that you may or may not agree with but that’s OK. That’s the beauty of a public forum. However you’re accusing others who do not necessarily agree with you of being racist. In other words you’re letting your strong convictions cloud your judgment of character.

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    Anonymous
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    #102504

    Vincelette, you’re not racist. You’re just outspoken. And that’s okay. People think I’m dumb bimbo but the thing is I’m not. I just don’t give a damn about any thinking before speaking. You can detest Viola Davis as much as you want. There’s nothing wrong with it. Oh, and how much it angers me when someone says: “I’m not racist… I’m not homophobic…” Of course you aren’t but the society is nowadays so oversensitive about some things that people feel the need of saying that before they give their opinion.

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    black30
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    #102505

    Well, I do think that Viola Davis is a medicore actress. And everytime I said that on any forums people called me racist for attacking a black actress when I’m not even say a word about her color but more about her overrated work. That’s also an issue.  

    The race topic is way to sensitive in my opinion and sometimes people who are from the USA trying to attack outsiders because they have a different opinion and calling them “racist” or “f.u.c.k” for poining out that it’s isn’t so obvious to say that “Viola Davis should’ve win, she’s a great actress” and so on. Or any black actors. It’s not obvious to like them. I have several black actors I like or several Oscars which they won I like but for example I can’t stand Octavia Spencer’s Oscar win. She was the weakest supporting in The Help. Of course it would have been also “racist” for so many of the fans that the Academy would’ve choose a white actress to win for a movie which was about black maids…

    So the main thing I would like to say about this that sometimes people are not racist for telling that someone is not good. I’m judging based on the performances.  

    It was wrong of me to attack you and for that I apologize. You have every right to your feelings even if I’m incensed by them. Not liking Viola Davis’ acting doesn’t make you a racist person by default. 

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    Titanium
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    #102506

    I agree with Vincelette’s point about Spencer and Chastain.

    I find it very worrying too, that a lot of voters probably voted for Spencer just to have an “I’m not a racist!” card so they could feel safer not voting for Davis in lead. I honestly think if Davis won instead of Streep, Chastain would’ve won instead of Spencer. It just frustrates me that it became so tit-for-tat regarding race! I mean can’t they just vote for the best performance… oh wait that’s never gonna happen!

    For the record, my favourites that year in lead weren’t even nominated (Kirsten Dunst in Melancholia and Anna Paquin in Margaret), but I was rooting for Rooney Mara; before anyone accuses me of being Team Streep or Team Davis.

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    ENGLAND
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    #102507

    I’m sorry but I think Vincellette is completely wrong. Making comments like Octavia and Viola getting nods because they are black is a very rude comment. Im only 15% black and I was offended by that. Why mention Octavia as if there are not white actresses who have questionable Oscars. Vinc always makes comments about black actresses and actors that come off negative. Im sorry but he needs to change his attitude. If someone likes an actor or performance, then you have every right to not like it but you should never say “race” is the reason why someone is nominated. I personally thought Spencer win was a good win and Chastain has not yet given a winning performance. Even with ZD30, she did not deserve her Golden Globe or Critics choice imo. All people who are considered colored have it harder in Hollywood so those nasty comments you make can hurt.

     

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    Anonymous
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    #102508

    I’m sorry but I think Vincellette is completely wrong. Making comments like Octavia and Viola getting nods because they are black is a very rude comment. Im only 15% black and I was offended by that. Why mention Octavia as if there are not white actresses who have questionable Oscars. Vinc always makes comments about black actresses and actors that come off negative. Im sorry but he needs to change his attitude. If someone likes an actor or performance, then you have every right to not like it but you should never say “race” is the reason why someone is nominated. I personally thought Spencer win was a good win and Chastain has not yet given a winning performance. Even with ZD30, she did not deserve her Golden Globe or Critics choice imo. All people who are considered colored have it harder in Hollywood so those nasty comments you make can hurt.

     

    I never said that Octavia Spencer or Viola Davis getting nominations for being black. I said that it would have been very wierd for some people if Chastain would’ve win over Spencer when the movie is about black maids and that’s a big difference. 

    I’m not making comments about black people in a negative way I’m just tired to see the hysteria around them because their color gets more bold words than their actual performance. That’s my problem.

    Well, I think Spencer never did anything Oscar-worthy in her entire life, but she was Emmy-worthy in Ugly Betty. About Chastain. She’s much better actress and had plenty of more memorable performances: “The Help” “Zero Dark Thirty” “Tree of Life” “Take Shelter” “Mama” “The Debt”. 

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