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2019 Goldies awards category placements discussion

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    FreemanGriffin
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    #1203175986

    When I swim each morning I sometimes think about the daytime soaps, and this morning I was thinking about category placements for lead actors and actresses from each of the shows. With B&B it was easy, the cast is smaller and there is a bit more clarity about who are the true leads of the show. This is my current thinking and am wondering what others think? We can also start discussing Guest/Limited Performers, Younger Actor and Actress eligibility, and other categories…

    Lead Actor:

    B&B: Matthew Atkinson (Thomas), Scott Clifton (Liam), Don Diamont (Bill) and Thorsten Kaye (Ridge)

    Days: Brandon Barash (Stefan), Eric Martsolf (Brady), Greg Vaughan (Eric) and Robert Scott Wilson (Ben)

    GH: Maurice Benard (Sonny), Steve Burton (Jason), Roger Howarth (Franco) and Billy J Miller (Drew)

    Y&R: Peter Bergman (Jack), Eric Braeden (Victor), Mark Grossman (Adam) and Jason Thompson (Billy)

    Lead Actress:

    B&B: Katherine Kelly Lang (Brooke), Jacqueline MacInnes Wood (Steffy), Annika Noelle (Hope), and Heather Tom (Katie)

    Days: Kristian Alfonso (Hope), Camila Banus (Gabi), Stacey Haiduk (Kristen and Susan) and Arianne Zucker (Kristen and Nicole)

    GH: Tamara Braun (Kim), Kelly Monaco (Sam), Maura West (Ava), and Laura Wright (Carly)

    Y&R: Sharon Case (Sharon), Melissa Clare Egan (Chelsea), Amelia Heinle (Victoria) and Melody Thomas Scott (Nikki)

    Do any of these in your opinion belong in supporting or are there others who you would consider to be more of a lead than anyone on my lists?

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    EmmyLoser
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    #1203177729

    I think I agree with your DAYS choices as of now. Matthew Ashford seemed to be on a lot this year, so I could see switching him in for maybe Robert Scott Wilson, though Ben has become the hero of the show and I think belongs there more.

    For GH actors, I agree that Steve Burton and Roger Howarth are leads for sure. After that, there’s kind of a second tier of leading men that includes Maurice Benard, Michael Easton, James Patrick Stuart, Donnell Turner, and Coby Ryan McLaughlin. I don’t really see Billy Miller as a factor here. Jon Lindstrom was a lead for the first quarter, but really faded after. Michael Easton seems the strongest candidate among those, as Finn has been a lead in a romantic story and work-related stories, and maintained a strong presence throughout the year. For pretty much the same reasons, I’d also go with Donnell Turner. Sonny has been on a lot, but he’s also mostly just been reacting to other people’s stories and getting superficially involved briefly.

    Similarly, in lead actress, I’d bump Tamara Braun and Laura Wright in favor of Genie Francis and Rebecca Herbst. Laura and Elizabeth feel like more central characters playing more pivotal roles in storylines than either Kim or Carly, though, again, I know both of those characters got plenty of screen time in 2019, mostly to worry/cry over their kids.

    Just my two cents.

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    linecelts
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    #1203177815

    Don’t watch GH so can’t say but I would think Bryton James could be Lead with Devon having to deal with both Hillary & Neil’s death, having dreams/nightmares of Hillary and trying to move on with Elena. I could be wrong but other than that, I like your list.

    I would mostly say KKL (B&B) and MTS (Y&R) are more Supporting than Lead

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    FreemanGriffin
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    #1203178108

    I think I agree with your DAYS choices as of now. Matthew Ashford seemed to be on a lot this year, so I could see switching him in for maybe Robert Scott Wilson, though Ben has become the hero of the show and I think belongs there more.

    For GH actors, I agree that Steve Burton and Roger Howarth are leads for sure. After that, there’s kind of a second tier of leading men that includes Maurice Benard, Michael Easton, James Patrick Stuart, Donnell Turner, and Coby Ryan McLaughlin. I don’t really see Billy Miller as a factor here. Jon Lindstrom was a lead for the first quarter, but really faded after. Michael Easton seems the strongest candidate among those, as Finn has been a lead in a romantic story and work-related stories, and maintained a strong presence throughout the year. For pretty much the same reasons, I’d also go with Donnell Turner. Sonny has been on a lot, but he’s also mostly just been reacting to other people’s stories and getting superficially involved briefly.

    Similarly, in lead actress, I’d bump Tamara Braun and Laura Wright in favor of Genie Francis and Rebecca Herbst. Laura and Elizabeth feel like more central characters playing more pivotal roles in storylines than either Kim or Carly, though, again, I know both of those characters got plenty of screen time in 2019, mostly to worry/cry over their kids.

    Just my two cents.

    I would agree with you about Genie Francis and Rebecca Herbst; I have preferred their work but Ms. Braun had the superb lead performances during Oscar’s illness and death – I will go with whatever a majority wants of course!

    And while I think Jon Lindstrom will submit in lead again this year, and has the material from the first four months to be competitive, I would agree he is more of a supporting player for the rest of the year. (This was a problem with so many actors and actresses this year – they had great lead material for several months and then were practically day players for the rest of the year! I exaggerate, but not by much!) Yes, Coby Ryan McLaughlin belongs in lead – almost the whole year was dominated by Shiloh, for better or for worse. I think Billy Miller will submit in lead and has great material but it’s true that the rest of the year he fizzled out (outside of the Oscar’s illness/death story).

    linecelts mentions that he thinks KKL and MTS belong in supporting – who would replace them as potential lead actresses from those two CBS soaps? Again, in a few months time when we have the official ballot it could look different, once there is feedback on placements.

    Yes, Matthew Ashford has been more of a lead and belongs there. Interesting thoughts!

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    linecelts
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    #1203178219

    I would agree with you about Genie Francis and Rebecca Herbst; I have preferred their work but Ms. Braun had the superb lead performances during Oscar’s illness and death – I will go with whatever a majority wants of course!

    And while I think Jon Lindstrom will submit in lead again this year, and has the material from the first four months to be competitive, I would agree he is more of a supporting player for the rest of the year. (This was a problem with so many actors and actresses this year – they had great lead material for several months and then were practically day players for the rest of the year! I exaggerate, but not by much!) Yes, Coby Ryan McLaughlin belongs in lead – almost the whole year was dominated by Shiloh, for better or for worse. I think Billy Miller will submit in lead and has great material but it’s true that the rest of the year he fizzled out (outside of the Oscar’s illness/death story).

    linecelts mentions that he thinks KKL and MTS belong in supporting – who would replace them as potential lead actresses from those two CBS soaps? Again, in a few months time when we have the official ballot it could look different, once there is feedback on placements.

    Yes, Matthew Ashford has been more of a lead and belongs there. Interesting thoughts!

    I’m gonna say Michelle Stafford (Phyllis) for Y&R. As far as B&B, really wouldn’t be anyone to replace KKL. Katrina Bowden (Flo) was Supporting

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    FreemanGriffin
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    #1203222095

    I have been thinking about the guest performers and limited performers. For me a limited performance is someone who is one infrequently, less than 20 air dates in a calendar year; and a Guest Performer is someone who is on for a very limited run of no more than 2 months… Not sure if all of these would fit my criteria, this is thinking aloud…

    I need help with B&B since I haven’t watched all that much in 2019. Wayne Brady and Hunter Tylo? Who else?

    Days: Robin Strasser, Alison Sweeney, Bryan Datillo, Martha Madison, Brandon Beemer, James Read, Chrishelle Stause, Judi Evans, Wally Kurth…. who else?

    GH: Nicolas Bechtel, Chloe Lanier (too many episodes?), Constance Towers, Inga Cadranel, Dominic Zamprogna, Hillary B Smith, Carolyn Hennesy, Lynn Herring, Jane Elliot (o.k., she hasn’t appeared yet, but she is on her way), Brad Maule (only one appearance but what a performance!), Hayley Erin, Matt Cohen, Denise Alexander… who else?

    Y&R: Jeffrey Vincent Parise, Elizabeth Hendrickson, Marla Adams (has she exceeded 20 episodes?), Tristan Rogers, Jess Walton, Christel Khalil, Shemar Moore, Eileen Davidson… who else?

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    alokin
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    #1203222770

    Just off the top of my head:

    Tisha Campbell (Dr. Davis, B&B), who was wonderful as Katie’s kidney specialist

    Vincent Irizarry (Dr. Jordan Armstrong, B&B), Thomas and Katie’s ER physician (so sad he didn’t get to extend his stay; Vincent would’ve made a fantastic regular player on the show)

    Cathy Marks (young Dina Mergeron, Y&R) and Jonathan Stoddard (young John Abbott) who both appeared in the show’s fall season premiere episode (such a sweet surprise!)

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    EmmyLoser
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    #1203227341

    Did Alison Sweeney appear on DAYS in 2019? I didn’t think she’d been on since fall of 2018. I don’t think Wally Kurth qualifies as limited for DAYS. He’s not on a lot, but I think he’s been on too much to be considered limited, and he’s getting a good amount of screen time since the time jump. I also think Lynn Herring and Chloe Lanier have been on too much to be categorized as “limited” on GH. Jessica Tuck would probably belong on the list for GH.

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    FreemanGriffin
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    #1203227636

    Yes, Alison Sweeney appeared when Will was dying, at the same time that Lucas was on the show as well. It was a very short visit this time. (She is returning next summer for a longer visit).

    I think Nicolas Bechtel belongs more in Guest/Limited than Younger Actor – agree or disagree?

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    EmmyLoser
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    #1203229074

    Wow, even now that you mention it, I barely remember that happening! I think that story, for me, ended up lost in the sea of people being in a coma/on the brink of death – Kate, Julie, Jennifer, Stefan who actually did die.

    I agree about Nicolas Bechtel.

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    FreemanGriffin
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    #1203233220

    coming up with only 4 leads for GH has been problematic – There are 6 in each category I think have had lead material this year. For Lead Actor they would be Maurice Benard, Steve Burton, Roger Howarth, Jon Lindstrom, Coby Ryan McLaughlin and Billy J Miller. For Lead Actress they would be Tamara Braun, Genie Francis, Rebecca Herbst, Kelly Monaco, Maura West and Laura Wright.

    I agree that Matthew Ashford could be considered lead but I think the four I have cited feel like leads too (Brandon Barash, Eric Martsolf, Greg Vaughan and Robert Scott Wilson).

    do we keep the four per show format we have had the past two years or do we abandon it? Voting keeps going down for the Goldies each year – a lack of interest in daytime soaps has definitely happened now that there are only 4 left and the quality of the shows has declined. Perhaps we ought to go back to the old format and everybody can just decide for themselves?

    I think Performer of the Year will be interesting this year – I have absolutely no idea who we will pick! Last year it was obvious who the winner was going to be and she (Maura West) won in a landslide.

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    EmmyLoser
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    #1203233632

    I’ve recently been reconsidering the idea of the four per show quota. Shows with a more balanced cast approach (this certainly applies to GH) will naturally have more to consider, whereas a show like B&B that mainly focuses on a small set of characters probably doesn’t really even have four real male or female leads. While I don’t think that it’s unreasonable to consider something more like six or seven candidates as leads per show, I do still think only four need to be up for awards consideration. That being said, deciding who is awards worthy is the whole point of the nomination process. So what if we made a list of all the potential leads and then voted informally here in the forums on who belongs where? The other thing we could do is just use the old style where people vote wherever they feel is appropriate, but with the change that all of a person’s votes count, just in the category in which they’ve gotten the most votes. What do you think, friends?

    Also, can we get Goldderby to put the voting for the Goldies in the prediction center? And if we did that, would you still be able to get and tabulate the results, Freeman? My thinking would be, hypothetically, that we do the nominations as we always have, but then use the prediction center for final voting. I don’t necessarily want to invite people to just vote randomly based on name recognition or very limited information, but there are potentially interested people who aren’t voting because it’s not as easy as voting for the Goldderby TV Awards or the Goldderby Movie Awards. But then, this also brings up the possibility of submitting a representative sample or something with each person, and who would even decide on that? Anyway, if that’s something we could possibly move toward, I’d be happy to help in any way I could.

    As for specifics, I still have a hard time seeing Jon Lindstrom or Billy Miller as leads. Miller had the screen time, I suppose, but never seemed important enough. Lindstrom had a few good months but has been on so infrequently since the climax of the Ryan story that he’d almost be a guest/limited performer for the second half of the year. But I would push for Michael Easton in lead, also think Donnell Turner and James Patrick Stuart are better lead candidates than Miller or Lindstrom. I agree with your lead actress list, even though I think Laura Wright and Maurice Benard are weak lead candidates this year who have basically more been overused supporting characters rather than leads.

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    FreemanGriffin
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    #1203233785

    Those are all good ideas. I just worry that it will be delayed for after the awards season and the biggest reason I asked to take it over was to do it earlier, when the year is fresher in our minds and before too much Emmy reels would influence the voting. If there is consensus as to how to proceed I am fine with whatever we decide.

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    alokin
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    #1203234505

    How about a five per show quota (with the exception of B&B and its smaller cast, which can remain at four) and we compile the list of all potential leads and proceed with the informal vote here in the forums?

    I agree with EmmyLoser’s assessment in regards to Jon Lindstrom and Billy Miller’s placement (and for similar reasons, Coby Ryan McLaughlin is also best positioned in supporting). I do however feel that Maurice Benard and Laura Wright should still qualify as lead players (given their involvement in major story surrounding Carly’s high-risk pregnancy and subsequent birth of baby Donna, and currently, Mike’s declining health). I agree though that Michael Easton, Donnell Turner and James Patrick Stuart all belong in lead.

    And I love the idea of voting for the Goldies through the Predictions Center!

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    FreemanGriffin
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    #1203234539

    An informal vote here on the forums is fine but my guess it will be only 3 or 4 of us who do so.

    My concern about voting on the predictions center is that it will postpone the voting for too many months if they were even agreeable to doing it. The reason I asked to take it over is that the Oscars meant that Daniel wasn’t available under afterwards and by the time of the voting the year was no longer fresh in our minds. If it could be done in January I would be on board with it.

    Another problem would be having to include every single name eligible for supporting actor and actress would be endless! Anyone not eligible for lead, guest/limited, or younger actor/actress (and those should continue to be separate imo) would be eligible for the supporting categories.

    These are all good ideas, just not sure how to put them into effect…

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