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Black Best Actress Winner

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    Atypical
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    #1204239559

    People can talk about it, but the outcome won’t be different if the given options are weak. McDormand was able to win because she was a strong, acclaimed part of the eventual Best Picture winner. She wouldn’t have had a chance if her movie would have been under 60 on Metascore, or if her movie would have been snubbed all across the board in key categories. Only Streep could manage the former, and she was overdue for her third.

    Not talking about the outcomes, but the talking point. If there are major POC contenders this year like J-Hud or Zendaya, for examples, it can’t help but be a talking point, especially after this year’s outcome. The media loves its narratives, and the 20-year anniversary of Halle Berry’s win with no successor yet is a big deal.

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    loudtoilet
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    #1204239628

    @Piper Halliwell

    People can talk about it, but the outcome won’t be different if the given options are weak.

    Yep like this year. More than any year before, if there was a year for quota narrative to work, it was this one but options were weak and better performance won. As is right. You cannot guilt trip 7000 or so people into voting because of some appalling statistic if performance(s) that would improve the stat are not as good as the competition. Between robbing a worthy winner of their win and improving a stat, awarding the best perfromance is the way to go. That’s what voters do, vote for the best, not for statistics. Also, speaking in pure numbers, who really has a motivation to vote based on quotas? Not foreign members who have nothing to do with American race relations and therefore need not and care not to “redeem” themselves by voting based on anything but performance quality/resonance.

    This thread is so strange for some people simultaniously beg for quota-based wins and are offended if  such (potential) wins are called quota wins.

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    Piper Halliwell
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    #1204239668

    @Piper Halliwell Yep like this year. More than any year before, if there was a year for quota narrative to work, it was this one but options were weak and better performance won. As is right. You cannot guilt trip 7000 or so people into voting because of some appalling statistic if performance(s) that would improve the stat are not as good as the competition. Between robbing a worthy winner of their win and improving a stat, awarding the best performance is the way to go. That’s what voters do, vote for the best, not for statistics. Also, speaking in pure numbers, who really has a motivation to vote based on quotas? Not foreign members who have nothing to do with American race relations and therefore need not and care not to “redeem” themselves by voting based on anything but performance quality/resonance. This thread is so strange for some people simultaniously beg for quota-based wins and are offended if such (potential) wins are called quota wins.

    What people don’t understand and what I think is the key issue here that with white contenders, there usually are a wild number of contenders from Julia Garner to Elisabeth Moss to Kate Winslet to Sophia Loren to Carrie Coon to Anya Taylor-Joy to Amy Adams..etc. So when a certain number of white contenders make the cut, there are a billion white contenders who don’t. But having only one or two visible POC contenders in the game is making people go crazy for their narratives, instead of thinking: is it right that there are only two visible POC contenders, to begin with? And more importantly, is it fair to assume that everybody is racist for not liking those two visible POC contenders enough to give them awards? It’s no wonder how the BAFTA jury would snub Viola or Andra and support 4 other POC instead. It means that they had the chance and opportunity to do so because they had more POC names involved. So we gotta ask ourselves, why there isn’t a campaign for films like Clemency, Rocks or The Forty-Year-Old Version? And why there aren’t more POC-led films produced by Hollywood?

    FYC 2022 Emmys:

    Best Actress in a Drama Series: Sandra Oh in "Killing Eve"

    Best Actress in a Comedy Series: Sandra Oh in "The Chair"

    Best Supporting Actress in a Drama Series: Kim Joo-ryoung in "Squid Game"

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    M: The Original
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    #1204239709

    It’s going to be a big talking point if there are any POC contenders in the category viable for the Oscar win.

    I feel like Negga going lead for Passing could do this.

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    M: The Original
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    #1204239715

    And what did she say?

    I am not a dog. I did not smell him.

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    loudtoilet
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    #1204239778

    What people don’t understand and what I think is the key issue here that with white contenders, there usually are a wild number of contenders from Julia Garner to Elisabeth Moss to Kate Winslet to Sophia Loren to Carrie Coon to Anya Taylor-Joy to Amy Adams..etc. So when a certain number of white contenders make the cut, there are a billion white contenders who don’t. But having only one or two visible POC contenders in the game is making people go crazy for their narratives, instead of thinking: is it right that there are only two visible POC contenders, to begin with? And more importantly, is it fair to assume that everybody is racist for not liking those two visible POC contenders enough to give them awards? It’s no wonder how the BAFTA jury would snub Viola or Andra and support 4 other POC instead. It means that they had the chance and opportunity to do so because they had more POC names involved. So we gotta ask ourselves, why there isn’t a campaign for films like Clemency, Rocks or The Forty-Year-Old Version? And why there aren’t more POC-led films produced by Hollywood?

    This is a great point and I only disagree that they don’t understand. They understand just fine but that doesn’t fit in their headcanon so they selectively remember what feeds it and memoryhole the rest. Take Lupita last year. She suffered from genreism like many other actors including Collette a year before. Their horror movies did not transcend the genre, were not seen as powerful social commentry or so but pure genre outtings and they missed nominations.Kaluuya was in a genre movie that was seen as a powerful social commentary so he amde the cut together with his movie, director, etc. Ditto Phoenix. Genre performances and movie always need something extra (translation: not seen as genre) to get considered.

    Then they said, but but Lupita swept all critics awards. Critics are influencers, not voters. The race doesn’t start til televised precursors and even then anyone who’s seen as also-run with no chance of winning is more vulnerable to missing than frontrunner and runner up (except if you are a director,  all bets are off with Director’s Brach, they just don’t give a ****).  Critics sweep did not help Ethan Hawke for First Reformed. Again, if your movie is super inaccessible, they won’t watch, they won’t vote.

    Or comebacks. Sandler and Murphy had a comeback last year but goodwill wasn’t enough to tide them over with AMPAS. So to cut the chase, your point stands correct. For every PoC that misses, there are 10 or more whites that miss for exactly the same reason (inaccessible movies, genre movies that remained firmly in the genre zone, undercampaigned movies, underseen movies, actors that industry gave up on or didn’t take seriously, etc). But since that doesn’t fit the headcanon, those cases are swept under the rug.

    Wins will happen when performances are deemed the best in their category. Like every time. It doesn’t matter what one around here personally thinks is the best, voters vote for what they think is the best and all the outside shilling and drilling won’t work if it isn’t in support of the one they like the best. And such performances would win without shilling and drilling anyway.

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    Piper Halliwell
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    #1204239794

    I am not a dog. I did not smell him.

    Good answer! 🙂

    FYC 2022 Emmys:

    Best Actress in a Drama Series: Sandra Oh in "Killing Eve"

    Best Actress in a Comedy Series: Sandra Oh in "The Chair"

    Best Supporting Actress in a Drama Series: Kim Joo-ryoung in "Squid Game"

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    Anna Artdeco
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    #1204240076

    Yeah, because that was all, right? McDormand is just some old white lady (I despise your derogatory, disrespectful tone) and Nomadland was just about this old white lady driving around America?

    Nothing disrespectful about it. I replied in the tone of the OG post which was actually pretty dismissing of Viola Davis and her incredible performance (s)

    And yes, that is pretty much what Nomadland is about.

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    Piper Halliwell
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    #1204240192

    Nothing disrespectful about it. I replied in the tone of the OG post which was actually pretty dismissing of Viola Davis and her incredible performance (s) And yes, that is pretty much what Nomadland is about.

    That comment didn’t offend Viola Davis, nor talked about her as she was some random actress, dismissing her film & work altogether. The user simply expressed their opinion on the performance.

    I couldn’t care less what you think of Nomadland or McDormand’s performance, but she’s been around for almost 40 years and she deserves more respect than you are giving her. She is not “some old white lady”. She is 4-time Oscar winner Frances McDormand, an industry veteran. Also, calling women ‘old’ is so off these days. You act as it’d be natural for a 63-year-old to win Oscars. McDormand is literally the third-oldest winner in the category.

    FYC 2022 Emmys:

    Best Actress in a Drama Series: Sandra Oh in "Killing Eve"

    Best Actress in a Comedy Series: Sandra Oh in "The Chair"

    Best Supporting Actress in a Drama Series: Kim Joo-ryoung in "Squid Game"

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    BigJay2012
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    #1204240228

    Nobody did Davis dirty this year. She didn’t have the performance and she didn’t have the movie. That’s all. If anyone was done dirty that was Mulligan but her role was never an AMPAS thing. Davis gave a lesser performance in a total AMPAS wheelhouse. Lyp-synch’d while her competition (Day) actually sang. Why would anyone in their right mind vote for Davis?

    Narratives shmarratives. They only serve as justification why a weak contender has a shot at winning (from weak contender’s stans POV not from the industry that votes one). If someone who supposedly has a narrative wins, it’s because voters found them the best not because of the narrative. Davis and Boseman only had narrative. They weren’t even close to the best in their categories and their movie was weak. They lost to better contenders. No rocket science.

    Now, on topic of lip-synchincing, Malek won for that too but there were huge differences:

    his movie was a boxoffice giant (900M worldwide) and a Picture contender

    He played a legend and managed enough likeness in the role forhis performance to resonate. And resonated it did (see boxoffice and awards). How many have heard of Ma Rainey? Freddie Mercury level of fame she was not.

    He didn’t go agianst a contender who sang on his own and he didn’t compete a year after another actor won for a singer role.

    He carried the movie, wasn’t a co-star who is a borderline supporting or upstaged by a co-star

    Ma Rainey IS a legend. She was from a very different time period singing a very different music, but Ma was definitely a legen.d

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    BigJay2012
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    #1204240230

    Nah, I don’t think so. She should’ve been the first, but she barely does movies anymore nor does she seem to have the energy to give an Oscar winning performance.

    Dorothy Dandridge should have been the first.

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    Piper Halliwell
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    #1204240426

    Funny, you pretty much dismissed Ma Rainey’s contribution to music in a previous post in your comparison to Freddie Mercury. Just because she never reached Freddie’s level of fame (most artists don’t) doesn’t change her status as a music legend, particularly in the genre blues…which influenced music as a whole for generations after her. If Frances should be held to a high regard, CERTAINLY Ma Rainey should.

    Pretty sure you got the wrong person, as I didn’t talk about any of this.

    FYC 2022 Emmys:

    Best Actress in a Drama Series: Sandra Oh in "Killing Eve"

    Best Actress in a Comedy Series: Sandra Oh in "The Chair"

    Best Supporting Actress in a Drama Series: Kim Joo-ryoung in "Squid Game"

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    BigJay2012
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    #1204240466

    Pretty sure you got the wrong person, as I didn’t talk about any of this.

    Whoops! I definitely meant that for another poster. Apologies…

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    Elazul
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    #1204240786

    It’s definitely derogatory to dismiss Frances like that but I can relate to the disappointment of awarding a 60+ white female for a third time and a 80+ white male for a second time instead of certain others who were at their first nominations. Both wins recalling On Golden Pond some forty years ago.

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    M: The Original
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    #1204240834

    It’s definitely derogatory to dismiss Frances like that but I can relate to the disappointment of awarding a 60+ white female for a third time and a 80+ white male for a second time instead of certain others who were at their first nominations. Both wins recalling On Golden Pond some forty years ago.

    I think the key difference is that Fonda and Hepburn had sentimental narratives giving them the vote. Whereas Hopkins hasn’t been this good in years and McDormand is the reason why her movie won best picture and its nonwhite female director won best director. Elephant in the room — nobody really likes Ma Rainey’s Black Bottom. It got recognized in the craft categories but had no passion to get people wins in the last leg of the season.

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