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  • Foolio
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    #1202692166

    I think this is terrible. Kevin Hart was telling JOKES. This is the dark side of political correctness. He wasn’t even saying some serious “damn all the gays and transgender people.” This isn’t some freaking “hate speech,” this was some guy shooting the shit.

    Actually, that’s exactly what he was saying, blatantly and in no uncertain terms, over and over: that being LGBTQI is something that deserves to be shamed, damned and feared. It wasn’t even the underlying message or between-the-lines implication of his jokes, it was their flat-out point.

    Fat faced fag is a hateful slur.

    If I can prevent my son from being gay I will is hate speech.

    Yo if my son comes home & try’s 2 play with my daughters doll house I’m going 2 break it over his head & say n my voice ‘stop that’s gay is basically the definition of homophobic hate speech.

    Imagine what it would feel like to be Kevin Hart’s son and discover that you’re gay. A joke is not okay when its purpose is to punch down vulnerable people. It’s just not.

    Political correctness does sometimes work against itself; people are occasionally unfairly judged for a misguided tweet or an accidental slip of the tongue and they’re not forgiven no matter how sincerely they apologize. That’s not fair because, like you said, nobody’s perfect.

    But that’s also not the case with Kevin Hart. He has repeatedly punched down the LGBTQI community both in his comedy and his public rhetoric, to what amounts to basically countless homophobic slurs some of which he has masked to look like jokes.

    Has he actually shown any remorse? No. Has he actually said he is not the person he used to be? No.

    In fact, he boasted about passing on the opportunity to apologize that the Academy gave him. That’s basically him saying he proudly continues to be as homophobic as ever.

    He has also said he wouldn’t tell those jokes again because the climate has changed. That’s not taking responsibility for his words, that’s blaming the climate for becoming more aware of homophobia.

    Make no mistake: if he’d shown true remorse he would deserve to be forgiven. All he had to do was say that he sincerely regrets his past jokes and hopes the public has it in its heart to forgive him. He would absolutely deserve a shot at hosting Oscars then.

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    AayaanUpadhyaya
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    #1202692167

    I think this is terrible. Kevin Hart was telling JOKES. This is the dark side of political correctness. He wasn’t even saying some serious “damn all the gays and transgender people.” This isn’t some freaking “hate speech,” this was some guy shooting the shit. He says he’s evolved since then, the way I look at it we’ve all got skeletons in our closet. I won’t miss what could have been his Oscar hosting, I think there are way better choices to be made (Michelle Wolf, Ali Wong, Bill Burr, Jim freaking Gaffigan!), but I completely disagree with this kind of thought policing authoritarian bullshit. Internet trolls won today, that’s all, which is unfortunate but it is the world we live in. I would not have said the type of shit Hart said (his use of a trans-slur was particularly cringe-worthy) but I don’t think this merits his firing as Oscar host due to the context of what he actually said. Kevin Hart isn’t Ted Cruz or Ben Shapiro and frikkin’ Milo. Shit, he isn’t even Louis C.K. or recent Oscar nominee (non-comedian) Mel Gibson! he doesn’t seem at all like a hateful individual. People can change and people are complicated. Are we never gonna let Dave Chappelle host the Oscars because some of his jokes have been considered “problematic” by the transgender community. Even I don’t agree with some of Chappelle’s transgender-related thoughts, but that’s one of the reasons why America is so great and special is that right to freedom of expression. I understand that doesn’t mean freedom from the potential social consequences of that expression, but I just don’t think for a second Hart’s consequences were what he deserved. That’s just my opinion.

    Okay I usually agree with you, but here you are completely in the wrong.
    Kevin Hart’s comments were fucking homophobic and it’s really not okay for you to give him a pass.

    I mean in what world does saying shit like “If my son were to play with his sister’s dollhouse I would break it on his head” not constitute being homophobic and dangerous? Throwing around the word “fag” to crack jokes is really not funny.

    I honestly don’t understand why straight guys aren’t ever able to understand that.

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    M Bocioaca
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    #1202692175

    Whoever hosts, please don’t start with a musical number.

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    Brayden Fitzsimmons
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    #1202692179

    I agree, the producers of the show would be wise to also consider performers who aren’t first and foremost comedians. Anne Hathaway and James Franco aren’t ones and they did an awful joke of a job, but Hugh Jackman isn’t one either and he did a great job.

    Jackman also had 20 years in live theatre before hosting (including hosting the Tonys) and unlike most non-comic hosts knows how to work a live audience, hell he even going on tour next summer

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    Foolio
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    #1202692184

    Jackman also had 20 years in live theatre before hosting (including hosting the Tonys) and unlike most non-comic hosts knows how to work a live audience, hell he even going on tour next summer

    That’s my point exactly: consider someone who would make a great host even if they’re not a comedian in the strict sense. A charismatic multi-talented performer who knows how to work an audience. It could even be a musician. Dolly Parton could do wonders.

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    Dan Jo Galicia
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    #1202692187

    I think this is the warning to any celebs. Don’t use social media to rant or to express any animosity. Even if it’s a decade long post it will resurface no matter what especially if your are doing something a big deal. It will kill your career.

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    M Bocioaca
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    #1202692198

    I think the Academy’s request for an official apology was right. Those comments are offensive to lgbt, especially children. The choice was already tonedeaf. I would have been okay with an apology, but alas.

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    Diet Teridax
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    #1202692202

    Kevin Hart wasn’t saying you should actually harm or even hate gays or trans people. He was not saying you should seriously hate people because of their sexual orientation or gender identity. I don’t think his jokes were funny either, I agree that use of ANY racial slurs isn’t funny, I’m just acknowledging the context that he intended it to be used in wasn’t some lazy demonstrative way, it was years ago and he says he’s changed since then. This is just James Gunn 2.0 all over again, and even then remember those jokes were about freaking pedophilia! It was really not okay for Kevin Hart to say that shit, but I’ve done and said (not like Hart) shit I’ve regretted later on. This isn’t Steven Crowder we’re talking about, some genuinely remorseless bigot with no humanity whatsoever. I’m not even a big fan of Hart to be honest, I just don’t think him casually shooting the shit with some words I would never have used deserves his firing. I find any use of any slurs revolting, even as “shooting the shit,” but I am still aware that context matters. This is another example of a groupthink mob overriding nuance.

    Should Hart have still apologized if only to save face? YES 100%!!! It was stubborn of him not to do so in my opinion. I know if I had been dumb enough to put that kind of shit out there in the world with a public platform like he is privileged to have, I most definitely would have offered some kind of mea culpa. I completely agree with @foolio on this particular point. “Make no mistake: if he’d shown true remorse he would deserve to be forgiven. All he had to do was say that he sincerely regrets his past jokes and hopes the public has it in its heart to forgive him. He would absolutely deserve a shot at hosting Oscars then.” The thing is, then it becomes a slippery slope as to what is and isn’t apology-needed. What about Bill Burr, Dave Chappelle, even Ali Wong has been pretty edgy with her racial comedy? The increasingly blurred lines of what is and isn’t okay to say in this day and age make me worry about the acceptance of free speech that isn’t intended to be seriously hateful or harmful in mainstream comedy in the future.

    Also, didn’t Jimmy Kimmel host The Man Show? Don’t even get me started on some of Chris Rock’s VERY un-PC jokes throughout the years, including (you know it) at least some about gay and transgender people. Both those actual Oscar hosts are not or were not always so innocent or PC either come to think of it in their comedic material. What about consistency?

    More importantly, the Oscars should never have hired a comedian that had that shit up in the FIRST PLACE! I think whether or not Hart should have been fired misses the arguably bigger point that along with that failed Popular Film category this is another example of the Oscars not knowing what the hell they’re doing. We live in extremely sensitive times, for better and for worse, so if those tweets were going to be any kind of issue they should never even considered Hart for the job.

    Feel free to totally disagree, that’s just my honest take on this easily avoidable shitshow.

    Note to myself: Don’t ever feed the trolls. Don’t get involved in others drama. Don’t let myself be swayed by others predictions, trust my gut more often!

    Note to all others: If you don’t happen to like me, ignore me. It is that simple.

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    Diet Teridax
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    #1202692214

    I think this is the warning to any celebs. Don’t use social media to rant or to express any animosity. Even if it’s a decade long post it will resurface no matter what especially if your are doing something a big deal. It will kill your career.

    Weird world we’re living in where I’m actually defending Kevin Hart of all people, one of the most popular comedians I happen to have total apathy towards. Chris Rock has done countless controversial jokes, including gay jokes many people would understandably not find funny and offensive, and people weren’t giving him nearly the same shit that they’re attacking Hart with. Isn’t it ironic that so many of the same people who want Ricky Gervais to host the Globes again (you know they are out there) in spite of his highly un-PC jokes he’s no doubt made more recently, are now going after Hart for the same damn shit?

    I do not think this will “kill” Hart’s career, since if Mel Gibson and Bryan Singer of all people are still getting hired for work I’m sure Hart will find some well-paying star roles in the future. Also, one of the guys who started this backlash to Hart’s past gay jokes (that is what they were, whether you find them funny ((I sure don’t)) or not) is Benjamin Lee. I know who he is and have found him to be quite the outrage troll scumbag in the past. Figures someone like him would be behind this.

    I want this to be my last comment on this matter, just remember that tomorrow is another day and inevitably another Oscars-related scandal quietly waiting to be unleashed onto the culture.

    Note to myself: Don’t ever feed the trolls. Don’t get involved in others drama. Don’t let myself be swayed by others predictions, trust my gut more often!

    Note to all others: If you don’t happen to like me, ignore me. It is that simple.

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    Foolio
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    #1202692223

    Kevin Hart wasn’t saying you should actually harm or even hate gays or trans people. He was not saying you should seriously hate people because of their sexual orientation or gender identity.

    The thing is, he was saying exactly that. Every single word in countless tweets and supposed jokes by him is the definition of hate speech. Let’s not for one second pretend that kind of rhetoric doesn’t cause a lot of harm and damage to people who are already vulnerable.

    it was years ago and he says he’s changed since then.

    But he hasn’t really said that. He has only said he wouldn’t say those things again because the climate has changed. As I wrote above, that’s not him taking responsibility for his words. That’s him blaming the climate for becoming more aware of homophobia.

    I find any use of any slurs revolting, even as “shooting the shit,” but I am still aware that context matters. This is another example of a groupthink mob overriding nuance.

    What context? I would understand the argument if there was any context that would compensate for the repeated homophobia of his jokes or if there actually was any kind of nuance to them.

    The very point of everything here is that there was no nuance. He’s been spitting out vilely LGBTQI-phobic jokes left, right and center for years, and he has refused to apologize.

    While he’s later tried to excuse that by claiming he was just reflecting and ridiculing his own attitudes, there is no nuance in the jokes indicating that his purpose was anything other than make fun of and punch down vulnerable people.

    Sometimes mob mentality really does override nuance, but I fail to see how that’s the case here. People who have called out Hart as well as the Oscars producers for hiring him have explained patiently and in detail why they consider his homophobic comments problematic. That’s not a mob, that’s a civilized discussion that’s absolutely called for.

    What about Bill Burr, Dave Chappelle, even Ali Wong has been pretty edgy with her racial comedy? The increasingly blurred lines of what is and isn’t okay to say in this day and age make me worry about the acceptance of free speech that isn’t intended to be seriously hateful or harmful in mainstream comedy in the future.

    Also, didn’t Jimmy Kimmel host The Man Show? Don’t even get me started on some of Chris Rock’s VERY un-PC jokes throughout the years, including (you know it) at least some about gay and transgender people. Both those actual Oscar hosts are not or were not always so innocent or PC either come to think of it in their comedic material. What about consistency?

    These are all valid points and questions. Where should the line be drawn? There are no easy answers that are applicable to all situations, are there?

    I guess we just have to go case by case. The cases of Kimmel and Rock, for instance, go to show that a person is not expected to be perfect or free of skeletons, and that opportunities are continually given to people who have messed up in the past. Kevin Hart would have kept his job as well if he’d apologized, but he refused to do that.

    More importantly, the Oscars should never have hired a comedian that had that shit up in the FIRST PLACE! I think whether or not Hart should have been fired misses the arguably bigger point that along with that failed Popular Film category this is another example of the Oscars not knowing what the hell they’re doing. We live in extremely sensitive times, for better and for worse, so if those tweets were going to be any kind of issue they should never even considered Hart for the job.

    This, I agree with. As I wrote before, how hard is it to do basic homework on the person you’re considering to hire? It’s not like Hart’s homophobia wasn’t out there for everyone to see to begin with.

    Feel free to totally disagree, that’s just my honest take on this easily avoidable shitshow.

    Again, I agree that this should have been avoided by not hiring him in the first place. Also, I enjoy disagreeing with you because with you it’s always a real discussion and never a personal attack.

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    Vincent Yeoh
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    #1202692229

    I am not a Kevin Hart fan but I wish he is being replaced not for this reason.

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    Eden
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    #1202692251

    Why do we even need a host? When the ceremony starts, bring last year’s four acting winners, let them say a word or two and you start with presenters. They wanted to cut time of the show, there’s how. We don’t need the host doing stupid things to entertain the audience.

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    Diet Teridax
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    #1202692261

    @foolio Thanks, while we disagree over whether Kevin Hart’s words in the specific context used was legitimately “dangerous” or homophobic, we agree he should never have been hired to host in the first place, as there are clearly more qualified people for the job. Also, while I liked Hart in Central Intelligence, I’ve always understood the criticism of him being just flat-out annoying.

    Seriously, someone should start a petition to get Amber Ruffin to host the Oscars. She’s smart, pulls no punches and always knows to punch up at the powerful for more biting comedy, and steals every moment she gets on Late Night with Seth Meyers. Amber could turn out to be one of the all-time great Oscar hosts if given the chance. Is she really THAT busy or expensive? She would be the first black woman host for the Academy Awards since Whoopi Goldberg and (correct me if I’m wrong) only the 2nd one ever? Come on! An opportunity to not only be diverse but to also showcase someone I consider an underrated comedic talent. Why not?

    Thanks for not insulting me over my differing opinions, people like you are why I still feel comfortable using Goldderby.

    Note to myself: Don’t ever feed the trolls. Don’t get involved in others drama. Don’t let myself be swayed by others predictions, trust my gut more often!

    Note to all others: If you don’t happen to like me, ignore me. It is that simple.

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    Brayden Fitzsimmons
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    #1202692297

    Weird world we’re living in where I’m actually defending Kevin Hart of all people, one of the most popular comedians I happen to have total apathy towards. Chris Rock has done countless controversial jokes, including gay jokes many people would understandably not find funny and offensive, and people weren’t giving him nearly the same shit that they’re attacking Hart with. Isn’t it ironic that so many of the same people who want Ricky Gervais to host the Globes again (you know they are out there) in spite of his highly un-PC jokes he’s no doubt made more recently, are now going after Hart for the same damn shit?

    I do not think this will “kill” Hart’s career, since if Mel Gibson and Bryan Singer of all people are still getting hired for work I’m sure Hart will find some well-paying star roles in the future. Also, one of the guys who started this backlash to Hart’s past gay jokes (that is what they were, whether you find them funny ((I sure don’t)) or not) is Benjamin Lee. I know who he is and have found him to be quite the outrage troll scumbag in the past. Figures someone like him would be behind this.

    I want this to be my last comment on this matter, just remember that tomorrow is another day and inevitably another Oscars-related scandal quietly waiting to be unleashed onto the culture.

    This, did everybody suddenly forget the last time he host he spend a good section joking about how long Jeffrey Tambour’s gentials are and how he tucks them to get into character

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    Emmyfan
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    #1202692304

    This is good news that Kevin Hart is being replaced. Not only is this type of behavior not acceptable, but he is far from funny and charismatic to host anything.

    The Oscars should have done their homework before announcing someone as a host. A lot of jobs do background checks before hiring people and some sort of background check should not be excused from the entertainment industry.

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