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Why have these artists not won in the Big Three?

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  • Mr Brightside
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    #1202808060

    Elton John: 0/7

    Mariah Carey: 0/8

    Lady Gaga:  0/7

    All 3 are huge, successful, talented artists who have longevity. (Gaga is still fairly young but she is obviously here for the long term) All are songwriters and two of them play instruments. They are all POP artists with widespread appeal giving them an advantage over other genres. They all have a decent amount of wins and nominations in various genres so the Academy obviously respects them enough; this isn’t like a Madonna or Diana Ross situation.

    Their peers have done it. Paul Simon and Stevie Wonder, Whitney Houston and Celine Dion, Adele and Taylor Swift, have all won in the general field multiple times as examples.

    There are rappers who have had a similar success rate (Eminem and Kendrick Lamar are also 0/8) but I think we all can see that rap is treated differently. Bruce Springsteen and Beyonce have had fairly poor showings (1/8 and 1/9 respectively) but at least have that one win.

    There are plenty of big name legends who have not won in the general field either (eg Prince) but they only have a few nominations to begin with.

    These 3 have had a lot of GF nominations, many years, or even decades, apart. And in all 3 categories.

    Is it a coincidence? Is there something about them that is a turn off? Their personality? Their image? Bad timing? Stiff competition? Because it’s not due to lack of success or talent or songwriting. I believe each have had various points of some level of critical acclaim with some even winning Oscars.

    I apologize if I have miscounted on some of the numbers, but I am only referring to nominations as a lead artist and not as a featured artist or as a group.

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    M
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    #1202808071

    Mariah Carey lost during a time when the Academy was trying to award indie choices instead of popular ones. Elton John losses are inexplicable.

    For Gaga:
    2010: She was just too new to win anything at the time. And many pop voters were voting for Beyoncé.
    2011: The committee shut out Bad Romance and I think she was too controversial to win at the time.
    2012: She obviously lost to Adele and rightfully so.
    2019: ???? Who knows what happened. My guess is that at the time the members were voting, they just didn’t feel Shallow was big enough (it didn’t win anything at the time and only peaked at #5). They probably thought This Is America defined the year more than Shallow. Shallow would’ve been a better contender for 2020.

    I still think Gaga will eventually win in the GF. Who knows maybe the fact she lost last year will allow her to be nominated for AoTY this year and possibly win if her competition isn’t strong.

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    Darren
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    #1202808117

    Mariah Carey lost during a time when the Academy was trying to award indie choices instead of popular ones.

    Her ’96 loss for AOTY (the one that made her have a bad attitude about the Grammys) was to one of the most successful albums of all time, that sold way more copies than Daydream.

    Her other general field losses were to massive commercial hits by Phil Collins/Bette Midler/Seal/Green Day and to Grammy darlings like Quincy Jones and U2, none of whom are indie or unknown.

    Mariah fans (and Mariah herself) use this excuse all the time and it’s never not been complete bullshit.

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    Mr Brightside
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    #1202808132

    Her ’96 loss for AOTY (the one that made her have a bad attitude about the Grammys) was to one of the most successful albums of all time, that sold way more copies than Daydream. Her other general field losses were to massive commercial hits by Phil Collins/Bette Midler/Seal/Green Day and to Grammy darlings like Quincy Jones and U2, none of whom are indie or unknown. Mariah fans (and Mariah herself) use this excuse all the time and it’s never not been complete bullshit.

    Agreed. Plus, as I said in the original post, some of her peers won during the same time. Also, not all her GF losses were during this “indie” time either.

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    PoweR
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    #1202808146

    Her ’96 loss for AOTY (the one that made her have a bad attitude about the Grammys) was to one of the most successful albums of all time, that sold way more copies than Daydream.

    Her other general field losses were to massive commercial hits by Phil Collins/Bette Midler/Seal/Green Day and to Grammy darlings like Quincy Jones and U2, none of whom are indie or unknown.

    Mariah fans (and Mariah herself) use this excuse all the time and it’s never not been complete bullshit.

    Exactly. I wonder which “obscure” tracks Mariah was referring to when she did that interview a few years ago. I bet she was talking about the years she lost to Anita Baker, k.d. lang and Annie Lennox, but none of those songs were “obscure,” unless she was talking about that Van Morrison song she lost to with “One Sweet Day”.

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    M
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    #1202808163

    Honey, […] Lady Gaga ha[s] NEVER deserved to win in the big three.

    She got something better

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    Matt2019
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    #1202808365

    Taylor Swift has never won ROTY and SOTY expect for her two AOTY wins.
    2010- You Belong To Me lost ROTY to Use Somebody and SOTY to Sigle Ladies
    2013- WANEGBT lost ROTY to Somebody That I use to Know
    2015-Shake It Off lost ROTY and SOTYto Stay With Me
    2016-Blank Space was defeated by Uptown Funk in ROTY and lost SOTY to Thinking Out Loud even though Thinking Out Loud could have been ineligible.

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    Dan Jo
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    Exactly. I wonder which “obscure” tracks Mariah was referring to when she did that interview a few years ago. I bet she was talking about the years she lost to Anita Baker, k.d. lang and Annie Lennox, but none of those songs were “obscure,” unless she was talking about that Van Morrison song she lost to with “One Sweet Day”.

    Her lost to Van Morrison was indeed shocking. You can express that NARAS was playing her terribly.

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    JDM
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    #1202808452

    Honey, Mariah Carey and Lady Gaga have NEVER deserved to win in the big three.

     

    Gaga should have been nominated in 2009 for best new artist and we all know it! And you’re really gonna sit there and say that Bad Romance wasn’t deserving of a SOTY or ROTY win? It didn’t even get nominated, what a shame

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    Why U So Obsessed?
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    Gaga’s early disadvantage was her Dance/Pop sound. Compared to Rock & Adult Contemporary acts like Kings of Leon or Adele, that kind of music probably felt trivial and of the time.

    Mariah was too “popular”. They were rewarding critical favorites during her dominance in the ‘90s.

    Elton is a surprising omission. He feels like a slam dunk GF winner. Especially in SOTY.

    “The best way to make someone feel small, is to not say anything to them at all” —>clicks ignore button

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    Mr Brightside
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    Gaga’s early disadvantage was her Dance/Pop sound. Compared to Rock & Adult Contemporary acts like Kings of Leon or Adele, that kind of music probably felt trivial and of the time. Mariah was too “popular”. They were rewarding critical favorites during her dominance in the ‘90s. Elton is a surprising omission. He feels like a slam dunk GF winner. Especially in SOTY.

    I don’t disagree about dance, but Gaga stopped with that sound, got more GF nods and still lost.

    Whitney and Celine were as popular, if not more, and they won multiple GF awards. Also, Mariah received GF nominations in the 2000s and still lost.

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    M
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    #1202809759

    I don’t disagree about dance, but Gaga stopped with that sound, got more GF nods and still lost. Whitney and Celine were as popular, if not more, and they won multiple GF awards. Also, Mariah received GF nominations in the 2000s and still lost.

    Gaga’s only shocking loss when with Shallow this year. It won every single award it was predicted to win in all awards show, including an Oscar, except Song Of The Year, which I still can’t make sense of.

    It’s a mystery for sure, hence why I thought there’s a possibility of a committee pick. I was thinking maybe Pop Voters just don’t like her, but then she won with Joanne there which nobody saw coming. And she didn’t really need more than the Pop Vote to win SoTY.

    Maybe part of Pop Voters wanted to cast a political vote and voted for This Is America? We’ll never know.

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    vinny
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    Maybe part of Pop Voters wanted to cast a political vote and voted for This Is America? We’ll never know.

    I think that is what happened. Love the song though so was happy it won

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    jjjmoss
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    well it didn’t crack the hot 100 top 3 until after the oscars so there’s that

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    Blanche
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    Homophobia

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