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  • Stegeo
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    #1203080407

    Yeh Ik, that’s exactly why she won. She was just a non-factor quality wise.

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    Luca
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    This was a classic case of someone losing one year and us misinterpreting that as meaning that the voters are over that person instead of it just meaning that competition was particularly strong in one year. The last time that I remember us getting bitten like this was Jessica Lange winning for the first and third seasons of American Horror Story. She only lost for the second season because Laura Linney briefly entered the field, but we misinterpreted it as meaning that voters were over Lange.

    Which is exactly why I will stick with Sandra Oh in lead until the end. Last year she had Moss, Foy and Russell probably ahead of her – or maybe not even. Now they’re all not in contention, which should clear her path to victory. Plus, minus Wright, all of her rivals could have been nominated last year but were snubbed. So why should one of them all of a sudden surpass her? Yes, Jodie can steal votes, but she was already amazing in S1 and should have been nominated for it if she’s supposedly so strong that she could split the vote with Oh or even overcome her.

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    Gabarnes43
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    I completely agree, Sandra is probably the only person I’ve had in the top spot since we could start predicting the nominations. Mandy, Emilia, Jodie and Viola were all snubbed last year when Sandra was nominated ahead of them. HoC has no buzz at all and I don’t see Ozark winning anything.

    Globes FYC- Fleabag, Phoebe Waller Bridge, Jodie Comer, Dame Emma Thompson, The Crown

    SAG FYC- The Crown, Olivia Colman, Fleabag, PWB

    Critics Choice- Schitts Creek, Fleabag, Killing Eve, Bodyguard

    BAFTA- Fleabag, Killing Eve

    Oscars FYC ‘Little Women’ ‘Downton Abbey’ ‘Maggie Smith’

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    Rachel
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    Which is exactly why I will stick with Sandra Oh in lead until the end. Last year she had Moss, Foy and Russell probably ahead of her – or maybe not even. Now they’re all not in contention, which should clear her path to victory. Plus, minus Wright, all of her rivals could have been nominated last year but were snubbed. So why should one of them all of a sudden surpass her? Yes, Jodie can steal votes, but she was already amazing in S1 and should have been nominated for it if she’s supposedly so strong that she could split the vote with Oh or even overcome her.

    Jodie Comer didn’t have the name recognition in Season 1 as she does in Season 2. Everyone knows who she is now and it’s basically well known by everyone that she gave the better performance of the season. I think the younger and newer Academy voters voted for Comer and the more established Academy members went with Oh.

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    arabian
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    Williams sits way above both Shaw and Christie in the GD odds and has done for some time, which means there are definite supporters of her – I would love to hear rationale of those who are putting her at 1 or 2 or would vote for her.

    It’s pretty obvious and I’m frankly shocked that no one (hehehe) has brought up all of the reasons why Maisie Williams is a front-runner. I mean, someone even said that screen time was her only legit reason for a win. (Really?!)

    Early in the thread people were listing the nominees campaigning and said that Williams had done “none” and then amended that she had made the Comic-Con appearance where she shot down a popular fan theory. (Popular in the fandom, but not something that the voting bloc would care about like, uhm, at all.) Let me correct that whole ‘no campaigning’ bit there.

    Maisie has been appearing at fashion-related events left and right where a LOT of celebrities who make up the voting body appear. She’s also had a number of profiles that have discussed her nomination and work on the show. They may not be as mainstream as you all know, but they are definitely out there and no doubt have been seen by the voting Academy. Williams is also (by most accounts) very well liked and very well respected by her acting peers.

    Another thing that she has going for her, other than Headey, she is the ONLY other performer in the category who has been nominated before. Plus, she was nominated at the tender age of 18 her first go-round. She’s also been receiving rave reviews (and has received nominations and awards) for her performance as Arya Stark since she was 14 years old.

    As for the season itself… yes, she has more screen time than any of the GOT ladies, but it’s NOT just the screen time and it is NOT just her performing action sequences (although she performs those amazingly well). She also has offered up critically praised dramatic performances throughout the season… especially in the episode she submitted (“The Long Night” and the episode that her closest competition, Headey, submitted, “The Bells”).

    Many—even Williams/Arya fans—tend to forget just how much fantastic acting that “The Long Night” did offer because of how memorable the moment of killing the Night King was. But there was a lot of fantastic acting done by Williams in that episode.

    There was the entire library scene which was quite simply a silent masterclass in acting. That was nearly ten minutes of Maisie Williams just holding the entire audience rapt while she navigated the dangers of the Undead, but she never let you forget the very human fear, a fear that we normally don’t see in Arya. In addition, there was the contrast between her awesome, fearless fighting on the parapet taking out Wight after Wight with ease that contrasted with her later scared out of her mind, running from them through the halls of Winterfell.

    Also, we got the recall back to a younger Arya—the spitfire who fought to the very last—determined to save Beric, only to see her later, broken just a little more inside, dealing with his death, all because he had sacrificed himself for her. Then there was her reaction to Melisandre’s words, even as she was reeling from the attack from the Wights, Beric’s death, before returning to her confident, sure self when asked what one says to death. That calm reply showed us an Arya back in business. Williams delivered all of this smoothly, flawlessly.

    And in “The Bells” we saw nearly a complete arc of her character, going from the girl who lived for the God of Death, fighting for life amidst death before deciding to choose life. Yes, there was the direction which showed us the chaos and destruction, but it was Williams’ acting through which we felt all that was going on, including the peace that came after in her wordless scene with the white horse in the end. And voters will see so much of Maisie Williams in *that* episode submission from Lena Headey.

    So…

    • Previously nominated
    • Tons of screen time
    • Mingling non-stop with members of the voting bloc throughout the voting period
    • Various profiles on her, including an appearance—where she was the only female among her male cast, thus standing out even more—at Comic-Con.
    • Well-liked and respected by the voting bloc
    • Huge character arc throughout the season
    • Her episode submission has a HUGE moment (killing the Night King) and received TONS of media coverage
    • Her episode submission has two separate sequences that highlight her dramatic acting skills (the library, and Beric’s sacrifice/death) and received tons of critical acclaim
    • Lena Headey’s submission is another HUGE episode that highlights Arya’s character arc and showcases *Williams’* acting and received quite a ton of critical praise as well

    THAT is why Maisie Williams is so high up on so many people’s predictions of winning the Best Supporting Actress in a Drama Emmy. Why she is being so consistently overlooked in these forums is mind-boggling to me.

    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by  arabian.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by  arabian.
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    Rachel
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    #1203080967

    I think we can agree that the amount of screen time doesn’t matter (Cherry Jones). Her appearing at fashion events means nothing to me because so did Gwendoline Christie. Yes, she’s been nominated before but that’s because once again, HBO didn’t submit Gwendoline Christie. Since then, Gwendoline Christie has mingled and has become friends with many industry folks. No one in the industry really knows Maisie Williams… or at least not in the Academy. I don’t think Arya jumping around and killing the Night King (which 50% of people hated btw) will win her an Emmy. I still think Christie is higher up than she is. After reviewing the tapes today, it should 100% be Lena Headey that wins, but it will go to Fiona Shaw regardless.

    Emmy tapes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BbfTC_29jw&t=49s

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    Kellyemm
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    #1203081175
    • Previously nominated
    • Tons of screen time
    • Mingling non-stop with members of the voting bloc throughout the voting period
    • Various profiles on her, including an appearance—where she was the only female among her male cast, thus standing out even more—at Comic-Con.
    • Well-liked and respected by the voting bloc
    • Huge character arc throughout the season
    • Her episode submission has a HUGE moment (killing the Night King) and received TONS of media coverage
    • Her episode submission has two separate sequences that highlight her dramatic acting skills (the library, and Beric’s sacrifice/death) and received tons of critical acclaim
    • Lena Headey’s submission is another HUGE episode that highlights Arya’s character arc and showcases *Williams’* acting and received quite a ton of critical praise as well

    Previously nominated

    **Accurate and fair – plus, she doesn’t have the “nominated so many times never to win” feel of Headey.

    Tons of screen time

    **Accurate, but particularly in Headey’s submission. People do need to stop getting caught up in that beautiful 60 second dying clip on the submission video of Lena’s when Williams has like 15 minutes of screentime around it and watch the whole episode, or at least the last 20 or so minutes of it to grasp the Headey situation in context.

    Mingling non-stop with members of the voting bloc throughout the voting period

    There just isn’t any evidence of that. Where? I follow fashion stuff like a hawk. At Fashion Events in London when they’re mostly based in LA/New York? Plus if memory serves me correctly the only Fashion Week event during voting was Paris and I don’t recall her being at anything there. Fashion comparisons give her no advantage given other nominees involvement in similar fashion / theatre / comic-con etc events. Fashion people don’t vote. Actors do.  I mentioned SDCC only because it is in another stratosphere as Cons go.

    Various profiles on her, including an appearance—where she was the only female among her male cast, thus standing out even more—at Comic-Con.

    ***No one is doing profile interviews with her. She’s barely done an interview since the finale sans Comic Con. Which is fine. Neither has Dinklage. I like Maisie a heck of a lot – I actually really admire the Daisie stuff and the podcast etc. But she’s a “runs her own ship” sort of type of late in terms of what she puts out there.

    Well-liked and respected by the voting bloc

    ***Possibly fair given nomination at a young age

    Huge character arc throughout the season

    ***True, but probably ties with Christie. Headey had limited screen time and Turner was very political throughout.

    Her episode submission has a HUGE moment (killing the Night King) and received TONS of media coverage

    ****True, but that moment is not necessarily an ACTING moment.

    Her episode submission has two separate sequences that highlight her dramatic acting skills (the library, and Beric’s sacrifice/death) and received tons of critical acclaim

    ****The library sequence is excellent (one of my faves!) and I really like it – I have no qualms about it – but it’s really action-y to me – heavily laden in music, makeup, CGI beings, lighting effects – that I think it’s a hard one to get a clean “read” on her acting. I was trying to recall a previous winner with a similar performance that has won. My biggest concern with Maisie is this is a hard read and they simply don’t go for these sorts of performances.

    Lena Headey’s submission is another HUGE episode that highlights Arya’s character arc and showcases *Williams’* acting and received quite a ton of critical praise as well

    ***Absolutely 100% accurate and this is where she has a clear advantage over the others. Turner does not have another significant character episode. Headey does not have another significant character episode. Christie’s is episode 4 which is Emilia’s submission, not this category

    Some fair counterpoints.

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    eastwest
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    So I can see a whole bunch of dildos and nonsense, but me telling you all to essentially relax is too much? Message received.

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    arabian
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    Mingling non-stop with members of the voting bloc throughout the voting period There just isn’t any evidence of that. Where? I follow fashion stuff like a hawk. At Fashion Events in London when they’re mostly based in LA/New York? Plus if memory serves me correctly the only Fashion Week event during voting was Paris and I don’t recall her being at anything there.

    She was there. She sat in the front row with Danai Gurira and Janelle Monae (and Anna Wintour) of the Thom Browne show. She (and her boyfriend) actually wore Browne clothing; she was at other events as well. Vogue.com actually named her the Breakout Front Row Star of Paris Fashion Week. She was also at NYFW recently.

    Fashion comparisons give her no advantage given other nominees involvement in similar fashion / theatre / comic-con etc events. Fashion people don’t vote. Actors do.

    But actors are AT the fashion events all the time. In the front rows, at the events and they see Maisie, they talk to her. She was photographed with quite a few actors at these events. And, as I mentioned, I’ve heard nothing but love and respect when people in the industry talk about her.

    No one is doing profile interviews with her. She’s barely done an interview since the finale sans Comic Con.

    She’s done 4 magazine profiles (S Magazine, SSense, Tings, Super) all of which she was on the cover of — not big magazines, but press is press. She’s also been at a LOT more media events than she normally does. (I know because, yeah, I follow her career pretty dang closely.)

    True, but probably ties with Christie.

    Brienne’s arc was nowhere as huge as Arya’s. Arya went from cold/stand-offish, to a sexual/romantic relationship, still serving the god of Death to turning her back on her list and choosing to embrace life and explore what it has to offer. Brienne, well, Brienne.. finished her arc, but it didn’t encompass even remotely as much as Arya did in an entirety of one season.

    True, but that moment is not necessarily an ACTING moment.

    I never said it did. I just said that it was a big, memorable moment.

    The library sequence is excellent (one of my faves!) and I really like it – I have no qualms about it – but it’s really action-y to me – heavily laden in music, makeup, CGI beings, lighting effects – that I think it’s a hard one to get a clean “read” on her acting.

    I disagree (and quite a few critics do as well). I suggest watching it again. It’s her facial reactions that really make the scene work. Without her grounding Arya’s fear into a very real, human fear, the scene would likely come across as action affect and CGI. And there actually is barely any music at all in the library scene. It’s mostly quiet and relies on, again, Maisie selling the scene. Maisie selling Arya’s fear. Maisie selling the fact that as a little girl this was her home and now it’s been taken over the undead. *THAT* is what makes the scene so terrifying and horrifying. And *THAT* is why we buy that Arya–who we haven’t seen afraid of anything in forever–is believably terrified and running like a scared little girl the next time we see her. Because Maisie sells it with her acting.

    Turner does not have another significant character episode.

    Oh, hell, Turner doesn’t have one significant character episode, lol.

    Some fair counterpoints.

    I love Lena and I would have LOVED to see her win in season 05 or 06 (or 07), but I don’t want to see her win this season. I love Gwen, and I think that she’s phenomenal, but with everything that Maisie Williams has done, sigh… It’s just for me, with her brilliant performances from episode 1, season 1 that have continued all the way through to what she did this last season that truly was remarkable, man, I want her to take it. Especially because she has the screen time, she has the story/character arc, she has the wonderful performance, damnit, I really want to see her get that win.

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    Kellyemm
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    Ho

    I disagree (and quite a few critics do as well). I suggest watching it again. It’s her facial reactions that really make the scene work. Without her grounding Arya’s fear into a very real, human fear, the scene would likely come across as action affect and CGI. And there actually is barely any music at all in the library scene. It’s mostly quiet and relies on, again, Maisie selling the scene. Maisie selling Arya’s fear. Maisie selling the fact that as a little girl this was her home and now it’s been taken over the undead. *THAT* is what makes the scene so terrifying and horrifying. And *THAT* is why we buy that Arya–who we haven’t seen afraid of anything in forever–is believably terrified and running like a scared little girl the next time we see her. Because Maisie sells it with her acting.

    I think we’re on the same page. I’m not going to be disappointed by Maisie winning AT ALL – I’m pretty open in wanting a GoT lady to win though not being sure if it will – I’m genuinely more curious as to why she’s so low on the discussion when she’s so high on the odds! I’ve predicted Gwen and am pretty sympathetic to her winning but only by a touch. I’d be just as happy with one of the others, and I actually also really like the other two nominees (I think Julia’s great and I’ve watched all of Killing Eve)

    I have watched it back (when I refer to music I’m referring to the entire end sequence which also includes Alfie’s end scenes). It’s not that I don’t like it, I think she’s great and nuanced and it’s her very best work of the season, that’s not my point. But I’m ENGROSSED in the story at that point and the whole atmosphere – I’m not necessarily having a OH WOW HOW IS SHE DOING THAT moment. That for me is Episode 6 when she says goodbye to Jon/Kit – geez, she just about broke me and her entire time on the show flashed before my eyes). There’s enough levity in that moment to be able to sit and watch and enjoy their acting and performance rather than focus in whilst the world is crashing down around. (She also gets this with Rory McCann briefly in episode 5).

    ahhh and re that outfit – didn’t realise that was from PFW. Have seen both her and Janelle’s outfits separately. There you go.

    Are any of those articles online, or only in print?

    So I can see a whole bunch of dildos and nonsense, but me telling you all to essentially relax is too much? Message received.

    This is not a relaxation thread.

    I literally set this thread up under no illusions that it would probably become a somewhat derailed stanning good natured fight club for all parties. Have you SEEN the characters represented by these actresses? Carolyn Martens would have a field day with Arya Stark, lord help Cersei and Sansa if they ever lay eyes on each other again, and Ruth and Brienne would probably lay in to each other.

    (UNAPPRECIATED RUTH LANGMORE BALL KICKING STAN APPRECIATION VIDEO THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE REEL IN MY HUMBLE OPINION)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q43rhlZMXSo

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    arabian
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    It’s not that I don’t like it, I think she’s great and nuanced and it’s her very best work of the season, that’s not my point. But I’m ENGROSSED in the story at that point and the whole atmosphere – I’m not necessarily having a OH WOW HOW IS SHE DOING THAT moment.

    Fair enough, you may feel that way, but I read all of the reviews after each episode and Maisie’s acting in the library scene especially was mentioned quite a bit because of the reasons I mentioned. Plus, she DID submit the episode for her *acting* so for any of the voting bloc who DO watch it for that reason they will be specifically watching it for HER acting… and BOY, does she deliver! And the thing is… everything that happens–her running like a scared little girl, her fighting to go back and save Beric, her reaction to his death, her scene with Melisandre is all in reaction to what happened in the library. And Maisie plays all of that so beautifully.

    Her acting in TLN really is stellar.

    ahhh and re that outfit – didn’t realise that was from PFW. Have seen both her and Janelle’s outfits separately. There you go.

    Yup.

    Are any of those articles online, or only in print?

    I read them all online so, yeah, but I read them when they came out. I know there are more, I just listed the ones that were part of photo-shoots. I know she did others as well that didn’t include shoots.

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    Rachel
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    Geez, you guys write so much I can’t quote anything!

    “but I read all of the reviews after each episode and Maisie’s acting in the library scene especially was mentioned quite a bit because of the reasons I mentioned. Plus, she DID submit the episode for her *acting* so for any of the voting bloc who DO watch it for that reason they will be specifically watching it for HER acting… and BOY, does she deliver!”

    That scene was dumb. It also didn’t make ANY sense. Wights have never been quiet and creepy. They were always loud and impulsive (Hardhome, The Door) They gave them too much personality in that episode. Maisie was good in that scene I GUESS but I can always tell she’s not as experienced as the other actors and actresses. Same goes for Sophie. Her scenes with Peter Dinklage are TOUGH to watch.

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    thatnerdgreg
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    Geez, you guys write so much I can’t quote anything! “but I read all of the reviews after each episode and Maisie’s acting in the library scene especially was mentioned quite a bit because of the reasons I mentioned. Plus, she DID submit the episode for her *acting* so for any of the voting bloc who DO watch it for that reason they will be specifically watching it for HER acting… and BOY, does she deliver!” That scene was dumb. It also didn’t make ANY sense. Wights have never been quiet and creepy. They were always loud and impulsive (Hardhome, The Door) They gave them too much personality in that episode. Maisie was good in that scene I GUESS but I can always tell she’s not as experienced as the other actors and actresses. Same goes for Sophie. Her scenes with Peter Dinklage are TOUGH to watch.

    I actually thought Maisie’s strongest work in the series was when she had to act against Charles Dance in season 2. While Dance is the better actor, I thought she held her ground very well against him. Their moments together are also some of Dance’s best work in the series, likely standing out since it showed his character at his most sympathetic.

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    arabian
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    I actually thought Maisie’s strongest work in the series was when she had to act against Charles Dance in season 2. While Dance is the better actor, I thought she held her ground very well against him. Their moments together are also some of Dance’s best work in the series, likely standing out since it showed his character at his most sympathetic.

    Yes, her work against Charles Dance was very well done and she got great reviews for it (and I think should have been nominated for that season as well). However that doesn’t detract from how fabulous her acting was THIS season or how much she deserves the Emmy for the nomination she DID for her stellar work this season.

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    thatnerdgreg
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    Yes, her work against Charles Dance was very well done and she got great reviews for it (and I think should have been nominated for that season as well). However that doesn’t detract from how fabulous her acting was THIS season or how much she deserves the Emmy for the nomination she DID for her stellar work this season.

    I think Williams did a good job this season, but I wouldn’t have nominated her. I’ve gone on record saying I thought Arya was horribly annoying this year, and while that’s on the writers and not Williams, I still just couldn’t enjoy her work simply because I thought her character was way too insufferable. I say this as someone who loved Arya in earlier seasons.

    Also, I understand why she submitted it, but I don’t think The Long Night is as good of a tape as some people make it out to be. Williams isn’t really a consistent presence throughout the episode. Sure she pops up repeatedly, but the episode goes through so many different points of view so frequently that most of the actors’ performances didn’t make much of an impact on me (the only two who’s work really stuck with me were Alfie Allen and Carice van Houten) even though they all did good work. I’d say this is a definite flaw with The Long Night. Other battle episodes felt like more cohesive narratives since they didn’t have so many different people who had to share the spotlight equally. Sure, they might’ve had a decent amount of characters appearing, but unlike The Long Night, they made it clear which specific character was for all intents and purposes, the lead of that episode (Peter Dinklage was the main focus in Blackwater, Kit Harington was the main focus in Watchers on the Wall and Battle of the Bastards, and Emilia Clarke and Nikolaj Coster-Waldau both had about equal focus in The Spoils of War). The Long Night should’ve picked a specific character or characters to be the main focus for the episode. That way, it would’ve raised the emotional stakes and made the overall story easier to follow. I will cut the episode some slack though. It couldn’t have been easy to write having so many characters present. They clearly wanted to give a lot of them a decent amount of focus, but it just didn’t pay off in a satisfying way.

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