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Super Early Emmys 2020 Predictions (Part 4)

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  • Ivo Stoyanov
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    #1203130681

    I’m annoyed at people (like the dumb was above) for acting like Oh is a mediocre actress with a mediocre performance when there’s plenty of evidence to prove the contrary.

    Mediocre actress – no, mediocre performance – yes. Dumb for not liking her performance? Her own people tried to use the narrative with “the first Asian woman”, it is not my idea that she won those three awards mostly because of that. So, you are incapable to rationalize without insulting me personally? But then you are giving me lesson on moral, the irony.. Many of you try to describe me as rude and insensitive, but I have NEVER insulted anyone.

    And let’s be honest, if Oh was white then she would already be an Emmy winner most likely.

    Yes, just like Steve Carell, Michael J. Fox and Hugh Laurie.

    I don’t think it’s necessary to point the difference in the treatment of Close and Oh. Everyone’s aware of it. One was stood on a pedestal and the other was torn down. One was met with pity on her loss, the other with cheers.

    One has an incredible career full of iconic performances, the other have ONE good role before Killing Eve. And the joy was not towards her lost, but towards Comer’s win.

    When Oh was snubbed at TCA this year, comments were made about how her performance was inferior this year so that’s why she wasn’t nominated. The same thing happened to Brosnahan but I didn’t see anyone make such assumption then.

    Because it is truth in Oh’s case, I haven’t watched Maisel, but the consensus is that Brosnahan was even better in season 2.

    Contrary to what some people will gather from this, my point is why does Oh have to work harder than her white co-workers to get the same level of respect, acknowledgement and treatment?

    Not harder, EQUALLY good, which she didn’t do.

    The thing is most people preaching about racism here have a very myopic view about it. This isn’t a light issue. It’s more complex and deep-rooted than y’all realise. Remember that before you casually give some uninformed opinion on the internet about something again.

    This goes for you, it is a projection of you. It is not about race, it is about THE PERFORMANCE.

    Elisabeth Moss, Caitriona Balfe, Jodie Comer and Keri Russell gave superior performances and saying that does not make me racist, it makes me objective (at least giving the fact that I am expressing my opinion).

    I am the biggest fan of Yvonne Strahovksi here, but last year I praised Thandie Newton win more than anyone here, or at least as much as her biggest fans, I was one of the few that said that Newton did not won as a makeup reward for season 1, but purely on merit for season 2. Why you don’t quote me on that? Or about the fact that I was the only one that defended Regina King last year’s win, the only one that said that is not purely based on race. You do not quote me on that either. Because is easier to push FAKE narratives, so you can make people scare and guilty because they have dared to express their opinion on someone Asian, Black or Latin not deserving some award. Again, this doesn’t help anyone. And unlike you and the majority of people here, I am here with my real profile, picture and name, look my pictures and see the color of my skin, I am not even white…

    Luca
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    #1203130708

    If voters chose Comer instead of Oh because the the latter is of Asian descent and the former isn’t, then undoubtedly shame on them. But if they truly thought Comer did better work in S2, then how can you fault them for that? That’s the only point I really don’t get. I don’t think anyone is calling Oh a bad actress (I would have to laugh if they did), but her material in S2 just didn’t allow to her to do as much as Comer did. Even I found myself slightly rooting for Oh before the ceremony because I realized how great it would be if she finally got recognized by the academy that long owes her that statuette.

    As for WTSU, I will admit that I was pissed with a capital P that it underperformed as much as it did; it deserved so much better. The worst part about this entire season was the treatment it received in our forums: everyone labeling it as political propaganda just because it’s about the racial injustice in the US? How disgusting. People put a lot of hard work into this project; it’s a TV show like any other.

    And straight away I considered it a result of racist behavior from the TV academy – that WTSU was practically shut out while Chernobyl nearly swept, which in hindsight may or may not be fair. We’ll never truly know. I also won’t lie that after the ceremony ended, I realized that three of whitest shows won the top series prizes…

    My point earlier was that this Emmys-So-White/Oscars-So-White headline is starting to lose its meaning because it’s so loosely used. The problem that it actually tackles goes far deeper than what people give it credit far: The Hollywood execs are the ones that need pave the path for people of color to demonstrate their talent; it’s certainly there, but unlike white people they haven’t all been given the proper ground to showcase it. THAT’s the problem. In the end, my fear is that if we start calling every single decision racist, then we’re unconditionally lending credence to the belief that color should win over talent.

    Oscar FYC - Lupita Nyong'o & Elisabeth Moss ("Us") - Best Actress & Supporting Actress. It must happen; otherwise the Tethered are coming.

    Chfrik
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    #1203130773

    The fact that after all this conversation you still didn’t admit that the racism exists is very alarming

    Luca
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    #1203130806

    The fact that after all this conversation you still didn’t admit that the racism exists is very alarming

    It 100% exists, and it’s disgusting. But let’s not go ahead and pretend like every winner won because of their race. That’s not only ridiculous but also just very rude, because that means that at the same time you’re saying that Jerome and Porter won “just to make a statement,” which is such utter bull. They won because they’re freakin’ talented and gave searing performances (which doesn’t simultaneously cancel the notion that the TV academy is racist though). I remember when people deemed Viola’s win merely a statement, and that still bugs me until today, because she’s a freakin’ powerhouse. How classy to consider a winner a political statement when he or she isn’t white…

    Oscar FYC - Lupita Nyong'o & Elisabeth Moss ("Us") - Best Actress & Supporting Actress. It must happen; otherwise the Tethered are coming.

    Mukund
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    #1203130951

    That’s not only ridiculous but also just very rude, because that means that at the same time you’re saying that Jerome and Porter won “just to make a statement,” which is such utter bull.

    I agree, but shouldn’t the same extend to Oh as well? Why is her sweep so intricately linked with her being Asian? I do think there were worthier people nominated. I’ve mentioned how Moss should have a SAG by now. But my personal opinion on Oh’s win doesn’t give me the right to demean it with such baseless and yes, racist statements.

    I guess that’s the point of Couverture’s post? Jerome and Porter were thought as deserving but Oh wasn’t so her win was labelled as being PC. And Ivo, everyone calling it that way is no justification for you to do the same.

    Luca
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    #1203130957

    I agree, but shouldn’t the same extend to Oh as well? Why is her sweep so intricately linked with her being Asian? I do think there were worthier people nominated. I’ve mentioned how Moss should have a SAG by now. But my personal opinion on Oh’s win doesn’t give me the right to demean it with such baseless and yes, racist statements. I guess that’s the point of Couverture’s post? Jerome and Porter were thought as deserving but Oh wasn’t so her win was labelled as being PC. And Ivo, everyone calling it that way is no justification for you to do the same.

    Oh’s wins being touted as a PC statement is, as you say, absolutely ridiculous. I do firmly believe that the Globe sealed all those other awards for her though, which is so completely normal – it repeatedly happens (Patricia Arquette says hi). I think Oh won because she had tremendous momentum and is just generally well respected. Plus, all those wins were for S1 (and her material was great in that one). And let’s be a bit real here: this show wouldn’t as big a hit as it is without her, at least in the States.

    Oscar FYC - Lupita Nyong'o & Elisabeth Moss ("Us") - Best Actress & Supporting Actress. It must happen; otherwise the Tethered are coming.

    sofan
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    #1203130988

    Curiously I checked this year’s Oscar threads to see if they had the same reaction to another overdue narrative taking off. And as always, Goldderby didn’t fail to disappoint. I don’t think it’s necessary to point the difference in the treatment of Close and Oh. Everyone’s aware of it. One was stood on a pedestal and the other was torn down. One was met with pity on her loss, the other with cheers.

    Overdue narratives are bullshit. Whether you are black, white, Asian, Indian, Native American. It doesn’t matter, you should only win based on your performance and not a bullshit narrative. Both Oh and Close won awards they didn’t deserve based on this narrative but in the end the awards that mattered went to people who deserved it based on their performances. I’m sorry there are people treating both these losses differently but both are occasions for celebrations because they are a sign that performances still do matter.

    sofan
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    #1203130994

    And straight away I considered it a result of racist behavior from the TV academy – that WTSU was practically shut out while Chernobyl nearly swept, which in hindsight may or may not be fair. We’ll never truly know.

    BULLSHIT.

    Chernobyl won because it was easily the superior series. It was a global and cultural phenomenon. And saying it is a result of racist behavior on TV Academy’s part is laughable at best. You just need to see the reaction towards Chernobyl’s win to understand there was no racial prejudice against WTSU, people barely clapped for Chernobyl’s series win. It shows that it won based on merit and thanks to below the line voters.

    Luca
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    #1203131033

    BULLSHIT. Chernobyl won because it was easily the superior series. It was a global and cultural phenomenon. And saying it is a result of racist behavior on TV Academy’s part is laughable at best. You just need to see the reaction towards Chernobyl’s win to understand there was no racial prejudice against WTSU, people barely clapped for Chernobyl’s series win. It shows that it won based on merit and thanks to below the line voters.

    Lol. Did you even bother to read the entire paragraph you quoted? I said that that was my immediate reaction, which in hindsight really wasn’t that fair.

    Oscar FYC - Lupita Nyong'o & Elisabeth Moss ("Us") - Best Actress & Supporting Actress. It must happen; otherwise the Tethered are coming.

    Ivo Stoyanov
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    #1203131044

    Overdue narratives are bullshit. Whether you are black, white, Asian, Indian, Native American. It doesn’t matter, you should only win based on your performance and not a bullshit narrative. Both Oh and Close won awards they didn’t deserve based on this narrative but in the end the awards that mattered went to people who deserved it based on their performances. I’m sorry there are people treating both these losses differently but both are occasions for celebrations because they are a sign that performances still do matter.

    Exactly my point, thank you!!!

    I agree, but shouldn’t the same extend to Oh as well? Why is her sweep so intricately linked with her being Asian? I do think there were worthier people nominated. I’ve mentioned how Moss should have a SAG by now. But my personal opinion on Oh’s win doesn’t give me the right to demean it with such baseless and yes, racist statements.

    I guess that’s the point of Couverture’s post? Jerome and Porter were thought as deserving but Oh wasn’t so her win was labelled as being PC. And Ivo, everyone calling it that way is no justification for you to do the same.

    Because, unlike Porter and Jerome, she was never universally praised for neither season, especially for the second one, in season 1 she had great reviews, but no one saw her performance as one on the level of Porter or Jerome, or Moss or Foy, and she was ALWAYS seen as lesser than Comer for both seasons.

    My statement is not racist, much less baseless. I never said that she won those three awards only because she is Asian, NEVER, she had the narrative and momentum, the long time in the industry, but sadly, her narrative was based on her race, this came from her publicists and from the press. And yes, Mukund, maybe I do not have to pointed out like everybody else, but to be label as racist after my constant defend of When They See Us during the last 4 months, my battles with the fans of Jarred Harris who were attacking Jerome and many more example that I could have given is also not justifiable.

    Sandra Oh did not win those three award, because she is Asian, she won them because her publicists sold her overdue factor using her being Asian and the horrible misrepresentation (which I NEVER denied and which Luca explained perfectly) of Asians, this was her narrative, the press bought it as well. And Sandra Oh is too great actress to be advertised like this, all of us agree on that. I LOVE her on Grey’s, I find her mediocre in Killing Eve.

    But me saying she won the three awards undeservedly is not a racist statement, you, Makund, have said the exact same thing after every win of hers, everyone who watches TV, knows that there were, to quote you: “worthier nominees” in her categories.

    And Keri Russell deserves to be praised, because what she did is out of this world excellent acting.

    Instead of calling me “racist” and “dumb” ignoring all my previous comments, this user could have explained to me how can I express better myself since English is my THIRD language. Insulting me, trying to label me incorrectly and trying to censor me is not the right way.

    Mukund
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    #1203131077

    I don’t necessarily agree with him/her on every point Ivo and I know you don’t judge based on such things. He/she should have obviously been a bit more polite. But we shouldn’t be so narrow-minded to not consider that there are people who liked her performance more than we did and voted for her. There’s no quantifiable way to say that Oh’s performance was not as well received as say Porter because she did receive some serious praise from what I remember. And there was no overdue narrative at the Globes or SAG where she had won before so that point is moot.

    The thing is our opinion on her being deserving or not don’t matter. We don’t get to question the merit of her wins because we didn’t approve. Everyone has a narrative but that shouldn’t be the lone thing to define them or their awards success.

    Anonymous
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    #1203131091
    This post was found to be inappropriate by the moderators and has been removed.
    Mukund
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    #1203131094

    I don’t think Globes matter much when it comes to SAG on the TV side.

    Anonymous
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    #1203131102
    This post was found to be inappropriate by the moderators and has been removed.
    boss
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    #1203131167

    Limited Series will be extremely stacked. There will probably be additions to this list.

    Mrs. America – FX
    Devs – FX
    The Good Lord Bird – SHOWTIME
    The Loudest Voice – SHOWTIME
    The Undoing – HBO
    Years and Years – HBO
    Mrs. Fletcher – HBO
    Catherine the Great – HBO
    *I Know This Much Is True – HBO
    Unbelievable – NETFLIX
    Dracula – NETFLIX
    Black Mirror – NETFLIX
    Hollywood – NETFLIX
    Luther – BBC AMERICA
    Truth Be Told – APPLE TV+
    Little Fires Everywhere – HULU

    These are just the ones that stand a
    chance.
    *Might air in late 2020.

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